The ghost woman you encounter after the shape shifter and the mushroom cave... does anyone know how to find out how old she is?
meschlum Fri Sep 4 08:05:11 2020
You can find many useful things in the beginning of your adventure. And some dangerous ones too, but early on it's a good idea to explore a lot.
SPOILER
If you didn't find out before the ghoul's cave, you are too late.
SPOILER
And you'll need to do a little math, so read the text...
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MPerera Fri Sep 4 21:49:12 2020
Oh, now I get it. Thanks!
SPOILER
I was doing the math as in, 168-149, but there's a reason the text adds that she died 50 years ago (and why she asks how old she is now, rather than how old she was when she died).
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Vulpine Player Sat Oct 10 07:08:28 2020
I first came upon this type of book when I was very young, probably at the age of 13 or so. The story didn't seem so goofy back then, but it's certainly different now. Still, it was good fun, until I got killed by a Gretch!
Addison Thu Oct 22 13:30:49 2020
i died.
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damn rat box
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S CHEAH Sun Oct 25 22:41:16 2020
A truly magnificent and super hard adventure of epic proportions! But one which was so damn hard it got extremely frustrating at times, so much so that one might just feel like pulling their hair out! There was times when I had to go back to near the beginning to go along the right paths in order to find the essential items required by the final foe at the end.
Mage Mon Oct 18 07:35:50 2021
Woohoo! Completed once of the most difficult ones on the first day of my nostalgia trip. It can only get better, right...
Phil Sadler Wed Oct 27 19:56:28 2021
You're not gonna believe this, but a Hungarian version of this complete with colour cover and B/W internal illustrations, has just been completed:
Just click the download arrow at the top-right of the screen when you click the link.
I don't suppose anyone here actually IS Hungarian?
heero Wed May 18 16:38:27 2022
stupid ghoul
Thanatus Thu Jun 9 09:26:00 2022
Here lays the one who dies drawned
dave Wed Dec 21 16:02:08 2022
impossible game!
Robert Douglas Wed Dec 21 23:57:21 2022
@ Dave, Very difficult, but not impossible going by the stars on this thread. Some gamebooks - published or otherwise - are fiendishly challenging and take a fair bit of working out!
YARD Sat Sep 2 10:24:43 2023
Well.........
I practically have no words. This is the first, and hopefully only, gamebook where I didn't just resort to checking the comments section (happened a few times before), but also to right-clicking and even Ctrl-Fd through the downloadable version by the time even time itself couldn't beat the acid pool, tired of going in circles and beginning to doubt if ANY of the myriad items on the way were actually useless. (Turned out, many were.) This seemed preferable to putting up with the incredibly arbitrary logic of the proceedings, which can at most be condensed to loose guiding principles
* The stupidest possible thing is usually the right one, BECAUSE BRAVERY!!!
* If something hurts you when you pick it up, you'll definitely need it to win. Vice versa, if something actually raises your stats, you have most likely found a trap and should try anything else next time.
* Something which was the right thing to do once will probably be the wrong thing next time you are in a similar situation, and vice versa. Except when it still works the same way, that is.
* Oh, and don't expect even physical continuity. In the exact same locations, a slightly different choice can suddenly cause the character to overlook what he would otherwise spot in the same room, going the same route.
I still don't know what to think of that thing
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with the silver bow and arrow. I was UTTERLY convinced that assembling the full set was one of the main reasons the whole time travel was in place, and the moment you get all three is a triumph. I have no idea if all of this being a trap was an interesting subversion, or just awfully written waste of time. Same as the shop, the one which forces to do more counterintuitive BS just to interact with it in the first place, only for the entire thing to be proven useless again.
END SPOILER
At least I don't have to struggle to express my feelings about the ending - it was godawful. I can't say I was overly disappointed, as by that point I was far too tired of the whole thing to care much either way. There's a reason why video games frown upon drawing enemies out of thin air - and it's the same reason why being literally teleported to the dungeon by your enemy, having items or even teleporters summoned out of thin air for you by the villain or getting commented on in real time or told hints by him is such a nightshade to any narrative investment. The villain actually standing in place and rattling off the literal laundry list of what you need to try and kill him (well, most of it) is hilariously bad. It's particularly incongruent with the detailed violence, which lends surprising gravity to the proceedings - only for all of it to get wrested away by the above.
I did find it funny how I completely forgot the intended reason for why the character even went to that dungeon in the first place (beyond the whole "skies raining blood" thing) as the result, and had to reopen the starting page to recall who the ending even mentioned in the first place. And it is neat that clicking "CONTINUED..." lets you directly carry over your endgame stats to the sequel. What I see of it right now isn't exactly promising, though: just how out of touch does one have to be to think that anyone who went through ALL OF THIS is going to want MORE Trinitour, in any way, shape or form?
Why did I even bother to cheat so much so to get to the end, if I lost any real investment in the proceedings by then? Simply put - because even though this is the very first playable story on here, around 22 years old, I STILL found a massive trove of various typos and even outright bugs by the time I had to resort to cheating, and wasn't going to abandon that, or post them while only part-way through.
First, the literal bugs:
* Neither the silver mace, nor a certain shield, actually show up in your POSSESSIONS list (that last thing really convinced me at one point that the character simply didn't pick it up in the first place, and wouldn't do that without using one of the scrolls.)
* You can use the Potion of Fortune right as you get "Spider Man is preparing to bite!" message, but then it just takes you to 571 and nowhere else, and the way it appears with a clipped interface is clearly bugged.
* 305 and 392 do not show you "The End" or any comment box.
* drinking at 216 still gives the option to swim all over again afterwards. 273 still lets you go west even after you have already been there.
I am running out of comment space to include the typos, so I'll just end this comment here. offer a couple more observations on the differences between online and written versions, and on the general logic.
I can't reproduce the issue with the mace and shield not showing up, or the Spider Man one; if you see these again, could you send me the URL?
YARD Sat Sep 2 11:19:01 2023
Firstly, I'll go for a very common grammar issue which appears unique to this story: the tendency to place unneeded space before every ellipsis "..." Even the background is absolutely full of this. Other typos are only included when they are on the same ref as this.
SPOILER
40 "healing potions ... has she cast some sort of spell"
51
"Now ... do you own"
90
"it's face a picture of fear" +
"Well ... you have discovered my final deepest secret, you cause me to ... admire you" + "it's face a picture of fear"
110 "You wonder what the next one is ... you walk"
155
"I didn't think you ... had it in you ... brave warrior ... you are ... the ... victor ..."
+ "Please ... no"
+ "sprout to giant-sized wings"
+ "is the demons reply"
160
"you bravely enter the cloud ... the" + "Leave north (portcullis)?"
188
"of the most battle-weary of warriors ... but you're used to it now ..." + "Don't listen ... to him." + "the ... Demon" + "and ... save our souls" + "you ... can do it"
237
"and enter the mirror ... and pass through it safely!"
238
"A pity ... I was so looking"
261
"It must be ... it is!"
295 "it begins its decent back down to earth" +
"a transformation takes place ..."
328
"Of course ... it has to be!"
334
"by another familiar scene ... you"
344
"You find three ... but all look impossible."
413
"of course ... this is"
447
"and wish to offer you help ... tell me,"
END SPOILER
Now, the other typos are once again taking up too much comment space, so I'll place the other observations here.
SPOILER
* I am saddened you are not allowed to even TRY the flute on snakes.
* Or that candle does not work at 453, for that matter.
* Interesting that you have to use blunt weapons to fight stone and crystal enemies, but a solid steel one can beaten with a sword. Granted, its not real in the first place, so I suppose removing the option to use a sword would make it too blatant that the scroll is necessary. (Or convince people even more that fighting it is needed?)
* No option to turn back at 149.
* 189 is weird, considering how you discover an unidentified spell in the first place.
* Weird that the werewolf is guaranteed to hit you and drain a belladona even before the fight begins in the online version, but not in the original one. The software obviously supported on-hit effects leading to other refs already (i.e. cockatrice, ghoul, spider-man) so why not here? Did ffproject decide the whole thing needs to become harder still?
* Or was that an adjustment for the reduced number of trap items in both shops, or for the trap spectre not hurting you when used randomly?
* Similarly, how come you do not have the option to try the sword in the devil-shaped handle?
* Phil Sadler has commented many times here that his written version is easier than this one, but other than the ability to Ctrl-F/flip through, I am not quite sure what he means? Discovering the right use of scrolls through adding/subtracting paragraph numbers is hardly easier than simply trusting the computer.
* It would be nice to have SOME explanation at 405 of why the golden wish ring is worth 2 Luck points? It doesn't need to explain its only real use, but some hint of what it CANNOT do (i.e. save you from acid) would be great.
* It's so, SO cheap that both times you get the option to spare someone, but the only winning move is to kill, they die anyway. With the Rhino-Man, there's the added incongruency where he describes the place as his TOMB - but then begs for mercy, and bleeds as heavily as if he was alive. The Chaos Warrior scene could have been a lot more than shock value if healing did save her, and would have allowed her to act as a companion in battle (perhaps after you break the chain with mallet and spike?) This is like the ONE moment where the key item getting dropped by Trinitour directly would have been preferable to the state of things (you respect her sanctity too much to find the scroll, and this outweighs the whole thing getting bloodsoaked on the intended path?)
* Whose female laugh are you meant to be hearing when you fail to obtain/identify the Hellfire counterspell and die? The Chaos Warrior's? The librarian's? The other Chaos Warrior's? (Is there meant to be any relation between the two? I once tried seeing if offering potions to the first on the 2nd loop would make the second act nicer to you once you get there, but nope.)
END SPOILER
I'm not going to bother with ellipses. From the references online that I've seen so far, it appears that putting spaces before them is the correct thing to do anyway.
YARD Sat Sep 2 11:33:56 2023
To clarify one of the points above:
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It would obviously still be a trap option if you had learnt the spell and bought the spike and the mallet the first time you go through, then went back and this time healed the Chaos Warrior and broke the chain, as you would have still walked past the right door for that. Perhaps you would get the option to go back to the door in that case, but then that monster who appears but is not fought when you learn the word "Honour" would be summoned for real once you have opened that door, in a battle which you might survive, but she probably won't? It would at least to make the player in the end stretch feel any strong emotions besides frustration.
END SPOILER
Now, the remaining typos I spotted (I didn't try most of the post-acid trap options, particularly the ones which only appear with failed checks, so I would suggest ffproject personally gives them a second look.)
SPOILER
3
"that the on the western wall"
6
"What will you do: Open the door?" (no paragraph break)
7 spaces between options and question marks.
39 spaces between options and question marks.
45
"You whip out the warhammer and start to whack lumps of the crystal giant-man. (off?)"
50
"Will you continueor"
55
"few scraps of plain ill-fitting chainmail armour (plainly?)"
59
"in other words; it's transformations"
76
"but no sooner do I enter this terrible place than I have my sword stolen"
"the way you're going" you tell him with a frown." (period.)
"as I speak." you tell him."
86
"but it holds fast. Thenit"
120
Attack him regardless missing question mark
156
"clean of his hoofed feet"
157 and offer you no danger." his voice is cracked and weak. +
" I will fight back" The"
177
"(of enemies anyway, traps, are another matter):"
180
"atquite incredible speeds"
192
"a similarly restrained silent, warrior" (unneeded comma?)
194
"Try the tunnel ? (extra space.)"
199
"my last line in defence," (of?)
"the ABOMINATION" (missing period.)
"Its misshapen body (is?) covered in"
203
"a life-size painting of a beautiful, young, dark-skinned women" + "149-168AC"
214 "The women doesn't seem surprised" + "Deduct one LUCK point ." (extra space.) + "Use these spells on any enemies you suspect of being false by selecting it below" - singular/plurar confusion.
223 "amongst its body-parts."
226 "as best you can,"
227 "You may nevertheless try another question :"
228
"and its heading straight towards you." + "What will you do, fight this giant or run north as the Sentinel is quickly backing you into this tunnel." (Question mark?)
241
"And is reaching for you" (a pronoun might be missing here?)
244
"and shout 'Begone!'."
255
"seem unbearably loud"
273
"painted on the skull of some huge animal is , "To a" (space.)
288
"than a humans speech."
318
"all right, all right!" - capitalization.
"Your heart is full of goodness warrior...what little help I can.' (inconsistent quotation marks.)
"has come a little to late for me"
320
"most defiantly a monster;"
321
"and heaven knows - you'll need it!"
327
"which will you try ?" +spaces between the options and question marks.
330
"until you think you may finally of found something of interest"
337
"where will you search: the Rhino-Man?," + may be setting some sort of trap, (a?)
338
"it's only purpose in life"
354
"I can help you.".
363
"When ever you encounter a situation"
365
"whilst wiping tears from your face ,when, "
369
"you scream in the creatures face."
375
"A completely harmless (and?) rather cute animal" + "and covered in thick dark, brown fur." (may need another comma?)
379
"Give him the potions ?"
"he's a particularly thirsty fellow." the snake winks at you."
385
"If ever you think"
"The door isn't locked though, very strange ..."
399
"absorb the poor things good-fortune."
411
"when you here a strange, soft noise"
422
"your former opponent carefully.He begins" + "Just then, with out so much" + "Ignoreit?"
430
"(and hopefully not in to Hell.)"
448
"The women is chaotic;"
463 - hoping for the best. (question mark?)
477
" a fate worse then"
479
"and far from pleasant ..."
483 "you pass into a bone filled tunnel where you observe a rat casually munching (on?) a piece of cheese."
466
"Because you've forgot all"
483
"ignore the thing and carry on ..."
486 + 167 + 108 - spiders are not insects, come on!
So, this is the URL where I got the Spider-Man bug:
(DELETED)
I think the bugs to do with POSSESSIONS might be caused if their presence is combined with some of the things you do not need on the true ending path? Then again, perhaps I really did not look hard enough that time.
Also, I am glad to see that some typo fixes have already happened by now! Now that I finally know how to win, I can focus more on the text specifically, and have to offer some more.
SPOILER
2 - "But they soon leave. ." (extra period at the very end, an whole line down.)
7 - Walk west ?
12
"It looks at you, its face a mask of blood" (I thought it had two heads?)
108
" it has a demonic human face ... and a deadly bite."
123
"Then you walk in up to your waste" + "But it's probably nothing. You tell yourself." (Does this need to be two sentences?) + " is a fine looking silver mace" (hyphen?)
134
"All you have do now is defeat it ..."
154
"- it's not real after all." (Perhaps "not animate"? It is still a physical object, after all.) Also not sure if "war-hammer" needs a hyphen.
173 - the first two options are missing question marks.
194
"You consider running ... but a previously hidden rock-door" + " There are 2 objects behind the growling Manticore one of which glints provocatively" (comma?)
203
"with jet black hair" -shouldn't there be a hyphen here?
212
"But please go ahead ... I'm feeling hungry."
217
"As you reach the body of the Werewolf it changes back into the man it once was, he looks far less threatening now, peaceful even." (run-on sentence: perhaps needs to be split in two, or something other than commas?)
221
"your short rest as best you can"
263
"as good as dead ..."
276
"laughing high above you ..."
294
"a tall, scruffy white-haired young woman." (missing comma?) + " is apparently unarmed ... and strangely silent."
302
"and ... AARGH!" + "gets up and backs you into a corner ..."
303
"It's strange ... but the further"
336
"two pale skinned men" (hyphen?)
355
" your now useless weapon" (hyphen?)
366
"you wish you were that creature ... it is some time" + " complete with large red, handle" (missing "a" and a comma in the wrong place?)
367
"and he bids you, "Get lost."."
395
" you realise you're trapped ..."
405
"and ... find some!" (Also, perhaps "throw an item" should say "throw a rock", to make it clearer you are not wasting a Possession by trying this?)
433
"never solved anything ... unless you're a demon." + "before you can even think about saying, "So what?" "The latest version," (shouldn't there be SOME punctuation between two different quotations?)
456
" If ever you think you've found" (?) + ""Is it ... useful?" + "Yeah ... sure it is!" + "his name ..."
458 - spaces between question marks and the last three options.
463 - "to look down at you causing you to freeze in cold terror." (comma?)
483
"and carry on ..." (space)
515
"each with a picture of animal" (an?)
END SPOILER
I think I have in fact discovered one way in which this version is harder than the document due to interface specifically, and it's hardly what I would have expected.
SPOILER
At 426, the original writes out that the amount he wants is determined by a 2D6 roll, while here, you can easily assume that the amount is the same every time, only hidden. After going with 10+ most failed attempts to be on the safe side, I first went down to 9 and then to 8 on the winning run. Emboldened, I attempted 8 on this playtesting run as well, only for it to be insufficient (and to lose because I forgot to turn south at a key point.)
END SPOILER
Lastly, I just want to say that
SPOILER
When 299 describes cat's claws as ninja weapons, I was at first convinced that what you were REALLY supposed to do with them was to offer them to a librarian. Oh well.
Similarly, it's weird that you are told no-one has ever made it past the "Honour" password, yet once you are in Trinitour's room, there are a whole lot of dead and tortured warriors regardless? Did so many of them get captured by his servants and brought there?
END SPOILER
Thanks for the URL, I've fixed the Spider Man bug now. It is an issue associated with clicking on USE at a mid-fight reference, so I wouldn't be surprised if there are other instances of it out there.
